.:`=-~rANdOm~`-=:. Game Servers (Read Only) > Discussion
the struggle of being overweight
Sabb:
--- Quote from: Xrain on February 07, 2014, 06:14:14 PM ---I do not think you fully appreciate how antiquated BMI really is. When it first came out it was pretty much a state of the art index, the problem is, it came out around 1850. Yes that is the decade BEFORE the American civil war. Where our current best medical practice at the time consisted of if you had a slight issue on a limb, they cut it off with a dirty bone saw, where you subsequently got a serious infection and died.
Another state of the art medicine for the time was a pill called Blue Mass which its active ingredient was a great substance called mercury.
So a full 100 years later there was another medical "breakthrough" called Eugenics. Which was started in the US and then subsequently used by the Nazi party to justify sterilizing "undesirable people". This was nearly a full century after BMI was introduced. Oh we were also using things like skull measurements and proportion measurements of random African tribes to justify the superiority of certain races over others a full 40-50 years after BMI came out.
Mathematically BMI is completely flawed, it fails to take into account the square-cube law on increasing size and increasing mass.
So BMI should have died a long, long time ago.
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Spoiler (click to show/hide)
As I said, it's simply a ratio I can compare to based on what I know of other people's results as well. It's more accurate than me just making a good guess by estimating myself how much a person of that height may weigh on average, since it's an actual calculation of what I'm guessnig. You can disagree with me all you want but if you're going to make an estimate of how much a person should weigh, I see no reason that height wouldn't be the first, maybe most important factor that differs a person's weight. Again, reinforcing the fact that I'm not making an accurate judgement as to if his weight is healthy, it's simply a stat for me to quickly compare since I clearly don't have access to medical professionals to assess his weight. It's better than nothing is all I'm saying.
As for where you said it doesn't apply the square cube law I believe I understand. However, I've already said that it's a simply height to weight ratio and is only as accurate as it sounds lol. I see no reason it needs to apply that law because in order for it to do so wouldn't it need to include measurements like waist size? And wouldn't that defeat the purpose since waist size and other measurements would only vary as weight does, which is already included in the formula. Maybe I'm thinking of it wrong in which case you can feel free to correct me.
As for what you said about when it was invented, I wouldn't disregard anything's use just because of when or even how it was discovered/invented. It doesn't mean nothing viable could have come from it, in my opinion.
Besides, Coca Cola was invented not long after that time so the 1800's can't be so bad ;).
--- Quote from: saivon on February 07, 2014, 06:56:15 PM ---So there is a 3 pound allowance now so I can now become 116 :)))))) ;D :D :-X C:-) :money:
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That's good. It still could get difficult for you if you start gaining muscle mass and having to become even more lean though. Just be careful with that.
Frank:
--- Quote from: Sabb on February 08, 2014, 11:59:17 AM ---Spoiler (click to show/hide)
As I said, it's simply a ratio I can compare to based on what I know of other people's results as well. It's more accurate than me just making a good guess by estimating myself how much a person of that height may weigh on average, since it's an actual calculation of what I'm guessnig. You can disagree with me all you want but if you're going to make an estimate of how much a person should weigh, I see no reason that height wouldn't be the first, maybe most important factor that differs a person's weight. Again, reinforcing the fact that I'm not making an accurate judgement as to if his weight is healthy, it's simply a stat for me to quickly compare since I clearly don't have access to medical professionals to assess his weight. It's better than nothing is all I'm saying.
As for where you said it doesn't apply the square cube law I believe I understand. However, I've already said that it's a simply height to weight ratio and is only as accurate as it sounds lol. I see no reason it needs to apply that law because in order for it to do so wouldn't it need to include measurements like waist size? And wouldn't that defeat the purpose since waist size and other measurements would only vary as weight does, which is already included in the formula. Maybe I'm thinking of it wrong in which case you can feel free to correct me.
As for what you said about when it was invented, I wouldn't disregard anything's use just because of when or even how it was discovered/invented. It doesn't mean nothing viable could have come from it, in my opinion.
Besides, Coca Cola was invented not long after that time so the 1800's can't be so bad ;).That's good. It still could get difficult for you if you start gaining muscle mass and having to become even more lean though. Just be careful with that.
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Did you really just use Coca Cola as an example of old things that are good?
Sabb:
--- Quote from: Frank on February 08, 2014, 12:41:33 PM ---Did you really just use Coca Cola as an example of old things that are good?
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frank pls
Xrain:
--- Quote from: Sabb on February 08, 2014, 11:59:17 AM ---
As I said, it's simply a ratio I can compare to based on what I know of other people's results as well. It's more accurate than me just making a good guess by estimating myself how much a person of that height may weigh on average, since it's an actual calculation of what I'm guessnig. You can disagree with me all you want but if you're going to make an estimate of how much a person should weigh, I see no reason that height wouldn't be the first, maybe most important factor that differs a person's weight. Again, reinforcing the fact that I'm not making an accurate judgement as to if his weight is healthy, it's simply a stat for me to quickly compare since I clearly don't have access to medical professionals to assess his weight. It's better than nothing is all I'm saying.
As for where you said it doesn't apply the square cube law I believe I understand. However, I've already said that it's a simply height to weight ratio and is only as accurate as it sounds lol. I see no reason it needs to apply that law because in order for it to do so wouldn't it need to include measurements like waist size? And wouldn't that defeat the purpose since waist size and other measurements would only vary as weight does, which is already included in the formula. Maybe I'm thinking of it wrong in which case you can feel free to correct me.
As for what you said about when it was invented, I wouldn't disregard anything's use just because of when or even how it was discovered/invented. It doesn't mean nothing viable could have come from it, in my opinion.
Besides, Coca Cola was invented not long after that time so the 1800's can't be so bad ;).
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Dammit sabb, just because you can apply an equation to something doesn't mean it is any more or less accurate than other means, unless you prove otherwise. I could say that my awesomeness (Aw) is equal to (the speed of light ^2 times my mass) to the power of the number of aerospace projects I've done. Just because I have an equation doesn't for it doesn't mean that it actually pertains to anything.
So the square cube law states that as as shape grows in size its volume grows faster than its area. So since your mass is dictated by your volume, and your area is dictated by your height. BMI is completely useless for tall people like me, since I can fit more volume (aka more weight) into my given area (function of my height) than a short person would be able to. The index gets even more screwed up if you are a physically fit person, since muscle has a higher density than fat, the index also falls apart when confronted with this issue. So I have seen incredibly fit people ineligible for things, or forced to take extra training simply because BMI is such a crappy way to measure anything. Seriously it has issue in measuring, people of above average hight and people of above average fitness, it also falsly gives many normal people the impression that they are overweight.
According to the BMI index, my BMI is 30.4 which puts me in the category of being obese. You can look at me with your eyes and tell in a second that I am not an obese person. Which is why I said your eyes are much more useful for determining health than the BMI will ever be. Since you can pretty much tell by looking at someone if they are packing more weight than they should be. At least to a much more sufficient and accurate degree than the BMI is ever capable of. Assh.... WONDERFUL PEOPLE like you who think BMI is an "OK" way to guesstimate comparisons at a persons general health is why I have to pay more on my health insurance for having a high BMI index since the insurance company also thinks that it is an "OK" way to gauge a persons overall fitness. The only way to make things like this stop, is to completely and justifiably crush any sense of validity that BMI has, that way perhaps people will actually use real means to measure people's fitness.
Also prior to 1903 Coca Cola contained cocaine. In sufficient quantities to give you a buzz if you drank it.
Sabb:
--- Quote from: Xrain on February 08, 2014, 03:25:58 PM ---Dammit sabb, just because you can apply an equation to something doesn't mean it is any more or less accurate than other means, unless you prove otherwise. I could say that my awesomeness (Aw) is equal to (the speed of light ^2 times my mass) to the power of the number of aerospace projects I've done. Just because I have an equation doesn't for it doesn't mean that it actually pertains to anything.
So the square cube law states that as as shape grows in size its volume grows faster than its area. So since your mass is dictated by your volume, and your area is dictated by your height. BMI is completely useless for tall people like me, since I can fit more volume (aka more weight) into my given area (function of my height) than a short person would be able to. The index gets even more screwed up if you are a physically fit person, since muscle has a higher density than fat, the index also falls apart when confronted with this issue. So I have seen incredibly fit people ineligible for things, or forced to take extra training simply because BMI is such a crappy way to measure anything. Seriously it has issue in measuring, people of above average hight and people of above average fitness, it also falsly gives many normal people the impression that they are overweight.
According to the BMI index, my BMI is 30.4 which puts me in the category of being obese. You can look at me with your eyes and tell in a second that I am not an obese person. Which is why I said your eyes are much more useful for determining health than the BMI will ever be. Since you can pretty much tell by looking at someone if they are packing more weight than they should be. At least to a much more sufficient and accurate degree than the BMI is ever capable of. Assh.... WONDERFUL PEOPLE like you who think BMI is an "OK" way to guesstimate comparisons at a persons general health is why I have to pay more on my health insurance for having a high BMI index since the insurance company also thinks that it is an "OK" way to gauge a persons overall fitness. The only way to make things like this stop, is to completely and justifiably crush any sense of validity that BMI has, that way perhaps people will actually use real means to measure people's fitness.
Also prior to 1903 Coca Cola contained cocaine. In sufficient quantities to give you a buzz if you drank it.
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The equation was literally linked to show that I'm aware as I've said in I think almost every comment that BMI is only a height to rate ratio.
--- Quote from: Sabb on February 08, 2014, 11:59:17 AM ---As for where you said it doesn't apply the square cube law I believe I understand. However, I've already said that it's a simply height to weight ratio and is only as accurate as it sounds lol.
--- End quote ---
If I were to say any more at this point I'd be repeating myself. I'm aware it's not an accurate guess, however:
--- Quote from: Sabb on February 08, 2014, 11:59:17 AM ---It's better than nothing is all I'm saying.
--- End quote ---
--- Quote from: Xrain on February 08, 2014, 03:25:58 PM ---Also prior to 1903 Coca Cola contained cocaine. In sufficient quantities to give you a buzz if you drank it.
--- End quote ---
See what I mean? The 1800s can't be too bad 8 )
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