I want to see your opinions and suggestions based upon the discussion.

Nothing has been edited or removed:


Tuesday, June 22, 2010
9:40 PM - TBoy205: Hi.
9:40 PM - TBoy205: Do you have a moment?
9:41 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: ?
9:43 PM - TBoy205: You're the owner of RND, correct?
9:43 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: yah wassup
9:44 PM - TBoy205: Cool, I just wanted to know that I was playing on one of your servers the other day, and a player named yomo, or something of the likes, was claiming that he owned the server and was randomly killing people left and right. Not only that, he spammed about 50 large PHX plates, then left. Leaving them there.
9:44 PM - TBoy205: Tech had told me that he isn't even admin...
9:45 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: He jokes about owning the server and has some bad days
9:45 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: feel free to initiate a votekick if it follows terms
9:45 PM - TBoy205: He also tried to voteban about three people.
9:46 PM - TBoy205: Having a person like that on your server doesn't seem to smart. I wouldn't want someone on my server making it look like minge heaven...
9:46 PM - TBoy205: too*
9:46 PM - TBoy205: Just a heads up. . .
9:47 PM - TBoy205: Also, having the Adv dupe to respected only is quite annoying... Just a tip. Spamming 450 props is a much easier way to crash a server than to spawn a dupe.
9:47 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: actually it's not :/
9:47 PM - TBoy205: I own 2 servers myself and I co-own 6. I think I have an idea...
9:48 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: Well know that there have been dupes that spawn unfrozen and cause an engine crash
9:48 PM - TBoy205: I'm also very well experienced at building and with adv dupe.
9:48 PM - TBoy205: Whatever floats your boat. i was just giving a heads up. It made me want to leave and not come back
9:49 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: what part?
9:49 PM - TBoy205: The adv dupe and having someone claiming he owned the server and spamming.
9:49 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: well I can't change peoples attitudes
9:49 PM - TBoy205: Tech hadn't told me that he didnt own it for about 20 minutes
9:49 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: like i said you can warn an initiate votekick/ban
9:49 PM - TBoy205: Yes, but you can control who is in RND
9:49 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: I have limitations
9:49 PM - TBoy205: It's making RND look bad :|
9:50 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: The advanced dupe can be used to crash the server within a couple seconds
9:50 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: 400 props will only lag the server and admins can join
9:51 PM - TBoy205: The part about getting buffer overflow is true. But spawning 400 props in a dupe will not crash most servers. I've spawned 1200 on my server.
9:51 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: the server has not crashed with that many props unless the engine was overloaded
9:52 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: so solution for unwanted players = warning, votekick, voteban
9:52 PM - TBoy205: I had tried that, it wouldnt let me.
9:52 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: you need to have privileges, it gives you info on how to aquire them
9:53 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: You can also read more on the !info page in game
9:53 PM - TBoy205: Being able to use adv dupe should not be a privilege
9:53 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: or by visiting the website or forums
9:53 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: Well I obviously disagree, care to explain your point of view?
9:53 PM - TBoy205: http://img692.imageshack.us/img692/2893/trriverbankwip20036.jpg
9:53 PM - TBoy205: That is roughly 1350 props
9:54 PM - TBoy205: On my server, with 5 other people playing.
9:54 PM - TBoy205: No crash, what so ever.
9:54 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: I can definitely imagine lag
9:54 PM - TBoy205: 1400 IN and 29 FPS
9:54 PM - TBoy205: On a laptop.
9:55 PM - TBoy205: ~ 70 ping
9:55 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: 1350 physics based moving props would cause immense server load for 1 player alone
9:55 PM - TBoy205: Parenting.
9:55 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: That or perma weld tool can help
9:55 PM - TBoy205: I havn't gotten a chance to use Poly Weld, I just uploaded it to my server last night.
9:56 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: I heard really nice things about it, and that most serious bugs were fixed
9:56 PM - TBoy205: Cool
9:56 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: So you're a friend of tech?
9:56 PM - TBoy205: Yes, I am.
9:57 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: ah
9:57 PM - TBoy205: Along with Sanders
9:57 PM - TBoy205: Which he um, changed his name to RX-78 Gundam
9:58 PM - TBoy205: I believe I met tech when he commented on one of my FP threads. Then I had run into him at RND.
9:58 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: ah
9:59 PM - TBoy205: If you're so worried about noobs crashing your server, why don't you have Global Godmode on so people cant propkill or dm, which is exactly what yomo was doing last night to everyone.
10:00 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: Enabling godmode reduces the opportunities in game for players
10:00 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: that's unrelated to crashing ?
10:00 PM - TBoy205: Such as dying while trying to build?
10:00 PM - TBoy205: Because I absolutely LOVE that.
10:00 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: There are a couple things you can do
10:01 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: 1. Noclip
10:01 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: 2. warning, votekick, voteban
10:01 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: 3. Grab an admin
10:01 PM - TBoy205: No one was even online on steam...
10:01 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: 4. create a report on the forums
10:01 PM - TBoy205: Or godmode could be enabled and the problem wouldn't have even been started. . .
10:02 PM - TBoy205: Just saying
10:03 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: like i said it limits players that do use the functionlity
10:03 PM - TBoy205: Anyway... I was very dissapointed when I had played on your server. I thought that I'd let you know some things that irritated me so you could fix them if you'd like to improve the rate at which decent players join and keep coming back.
10:05 PM - TBoy205: On my server, there are no restrictions (excluding dynomite). All of the limits are at 5000 +. Because nothing irritates me more than when a server restricts you from using basic tools needed to build. AKA adv dupe, color, material, etc.
10:05 PM - TBoy205: I couldn't even SAVE my work on your server.
10:05 PM - TBoy205: That is fucking rediculous.
10:05 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: It's a sensible limit and easy to aquire?
10:06 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: keep in mind things have only been done to reduce what has happened
10:06 PM - TBoy205: Look, I'm letting you know what experienced builders look for in servers.
10:06 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: And I'm just responding?
10:06 PM - TBoy205: I don't want to go apply for respected to save something I made -.-
10:06 PM - TBoy205: That's common sense
10:07 PM - TBoy205: And who knows how long it could take. It may take a few days.
10:07 PM - TBoy205: I need to be able to save something right then and there.
10:07 PM - TBoy205: I understand applying for a rank.
10:08 PM - TBoy205: I do not understand applying to save your work.
10:08 PM - TBoy205: Do you see my point of view here?
10:08 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: Yes
10:08 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: It has also been considered before
10:09 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: but being a public server it presents complications
10:09 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: and so far thats how we dealt with things
10:09 PM - TBoy205: Half of my servers are public.
10:09 PM - TBoy205: The main reason you've got so many minges is because they're the only ones that dont care if they cant use adv dupe.
10:09 PM - TBoy205: Ever think of that?
10:09 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: In a genuine environment, the build server could only be accessible by those who would be dedicated to building without restrictions
10:10 PM - TBoy205: Well, maybe if you wouldn't have such outrageuous restrictions, dedicated builders may come more often and stick around more often.
10:10 PM - TBoy205: I think you're only seeing one side.
10:11 PM - TBoy205: I understand that you're trying to prevent minges, but you're approaching it completely wrong.
10:11 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: While this may be true, it doesn't discount the fact that 'mingies' are everywhere regardless of policy
10:11 PM - TBoy205: There ARE dedicated builders out there.
10:12 PM - TBoy205: One thing you're probably having trouble with is lack of administration.
10:12 PM - TBoy205: I've been on your server multiple times and I've never seen an admin...
10:13 PM - TBoy205: Some servers I go on, there's atleast 2 admins on every single time I join.
10:13 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: Not all times are covered 24/7
10:13 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: Time is donated by all the admins.
10:13 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: I also don't need a redundant amount of subpar admins
10:14 PM - TBoy205: One way I've managed to have maximum coverage, is have half of my community live in the UK. So when the Americans go to bed. The Brit's wake up and are on the server
10:14 PM - TBoy205: You may not be as lucky as I am to be able to do that though.
10:14 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: We have 1 guy from the UK as an admin
10:14 PM - TBoy205: I just happen to have quite a few friends in the UK that are very responsible
10:14 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: He hops around the servers every now and then
10:15 PM - TBoy205: Having adv dupe respected only is understandable if there is an admin on all the time that can promote you on the spot if he feels necesarry. That and only restricting the paste ability, which can be done...
10:16 PM - TBoy205: Restricting paste is one thing, restricting save is a whole different thing.
10:16 PM - TBoy205: Why stick around and build if you cant save?
10:16 PM - TBoy205: Your response would be "go apply"
10:17 PM - TBoy205: Why would I apply when  I can find another server in under 2 minutes?
10:17 PM - TBoy205: You've got to think of the situation from all points.
10:17 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: I obviously try to and also consider all feedback from users.
10:18 PM - TBoy205: Apparently, either no one has said anything, or you havn't done anything...
10:18 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: No one has told me what you have told me today
10:18 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: none of it actually
10:18 PM - TBoy205: That's why im doing it
10:18 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: That's why I'm listening
10:18 PM - TBoy205: I know what server owners like to know.
10:18 PM - TBoy205: So, I figured I could help you out a little
10:19 PM - TBoy205: I'm sure you'd like a few more dedicated players, wouldnt you?
10:19 PM - TBoy205: I know I would
10:19 PM - TBoy205: The server may crash every now and then, but since you've got votekick/voteban and an admin on "most of the time". That shouldnt be a problem, should it?
10:22 PM - .:~RND`=- coolzeldad -=: stability is one of the most important aspects, although so is player enjoyment so I'll consider things you have said
10:22 PM - TBoy205: Right now, all I see your server as is a "Minge Breeding Ground"
10:22 PM - TBoy205: >.>
10:22 PM - TBoy205: And I don't like to build at those.
10:23 PM - TBoy205: But, after all, it IS minge season....


Edit://Conversation after was unrelated to wirebuild.

Thanks for your feedback!
-coolz

Sounds like a real shit talker with his tone towards coolz.

Yomo minging =  True
Adv. Dupe restrictions = so cool

I have a life at the moment


Girl friend

Football

Mates

End of school

There aren't enough Admins online because they have lives and because there are, if I remember correctly, seven that are really active. (Magic, Tomcat, Cloud, Sniffles, Sanders, Moo, Coolz). Might have forgotten one, but that doesn't matter. Most people complaining about the lack of Admins are Europeans. That's simply because Magic is one of the only (if not the only) European Admin. And since Europe and America have approx. 8 hours difference, it's quite hard to find many Admins as European. I personally don't have any problems with not finding millions of Admins at once, but I think most other people have. I don't see the problem in the restrictions either. It's not hard to get Respected. Not. At. All.
But that's just my opinion again.

Hmm. So what can you do to allow newcommers to save their work and paste their work without allowing them the opportunity to crash the server? I can't think of something right now, but maybe we don't have to.

Actually maybe we should allow advanced dupe. It could lessen the amount of trolls applying for respected, while simultaneously making the server a more friendly environment for guests. As it stands the wirebuild server is sorta difficult for a veteran builder to get into, whereas a newbie builder that doesn't even know half the tools wont be dissuaded.

I may be underestimating the minging problem (since these tools were restricted since before I came here), but it could be worth a shot, at least for a little while. Maybe we could look into how other servers deal with the issue.

That's just my two cents.

This guy wouldnt let the whole adv dupe go LOL
But he sounds like a complete asshat all of the sudden talking to coolz like that :/
His tone wasnt very nice.