.:`=-~rANdOm~`-=:. Game Servers

Support (Read Only) => Suggestions => Topic started by: coolzeldad on July 07, 2012, 12:24:29 PM

Title: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: coolzeldad on July 07, 2012, 12:24:29 PM
Thanks to prox for the original thread, I am opening a new one with the new launch to give it a fresh start.. quoting original post (can be found here http://forum.randomgs.com/index.php/topic,7835.0.html (http://forum.randomgs.com/index.php/topic,7835.0.html) )

The official server rules can be found here (http://wiki.randomgs.com/index.php?title=Server_Rules).
Do not forget that in certain cases the rules may differ and this list should be used along with common sense.




The rules listed below may not be implemented or valid yet.

Global rules that apply on all servers

Spoiler (click to show/hide)



Rules of ZS.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)


Rules of TTT.


Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Rules of WS.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Rules of Wire build.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)


Rules of Fretta

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Rules of Stronghold


Spoiler (click to show/hide)

I might add more later.
If you think I forgot something just let me know and then I'll might update the list.
And don't hesitate to edit my posts, admins, if you found something wrong with the rules that I have listed.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Lavenchie on July 07, 2012, 01:10:14 PM
Quote
12. Killing a person if he refuses to go into a traitor tester is allowed, but will simply count as regular RDM
I actually consider this T-baiting because you would assume only a traitor would attempt to opt. out of a t-testing.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Pilgrim on July 07, 2012, 01:16:51 PM
Not really.
I for one never get tested on maps like crummy cradle or borders, as it is so easy to be killed in them.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Lavenchie on July 07, 2012, 01:19:39 PM
Not really.
I for one never get tested on maps like crummy cradle or borders, as it is so easy to be killed in them.
Well in one case you got an Innocent killing you because you refuse to prove your innocence
In the other case, you get in the T-Tester with people monitoring the button and would KOS anyone who would press it.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: » Magic « on July 07, 2012, 01:20:09 PM
wirebuild: no tool spamming
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Sabb on July 07, 2012, 01:26:31 PM
i have some modificaitons
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Travelsonic on July 14, 2012, 09:08:14 PM


On the killing w/ traps thing:  no, just no - if it doesn't affect karma, it shouldn't matter if it is a map trap or not, otherwise you just invite massive amounts of RDMing and minging that ruins game play.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Seb on July 14, 2012, 09:25:54 PM
i have some modificaitons

11. Killing with the bridge on crummycradle is funny as fuck and allowed

ftfy



Quote

13. Making a cade with indestructible props even when zombies can get through it is not allowed


Why? Zombies can get through, it's just a matter of hitting enough to get rid of the nails.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Sabb on July 14, 2012, 10:15:06 PM
On the killing w/ traps thing:  no, just no - if it doesn't affect karma, it shouldn't matter if it is a map trap or not, otherwise you just invite massive amounts of RDMing and minging that ruins game play.
Actually, I think this should be discussed. I personally think that killing with a map trap should in any situation be fine as long as you don't lose karma for it and it's not a detective or traitor buddy that you're killing. Keep in mind, it's not like we have any maps that can kill a large amount of people on the server without it really being to their fault without losing karma.
And it does sound silly, but basically I don't consider it RDM if the trap doesn't affect karma. If it does, obviously it is RDM. Basically people can always really quite easily avoid being killed by any non-karmable map trap, and it's simply part of the map anyways. If that's there and a problem, the map simply should be removed. But anyways, non-karmable map traps can actually be an easy way to get rid of foolish/reckless players more or less. Can eliminate people you might suspect and stuff in a way that I personally think is fairly legitimate, as again, there's not really any map trap that's non-karmable which you can not simply avoid.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Shockah on July 14, 2012, 11:36:14 PM
18. Claiming rooms, territory, etc. is not allowed
I really think this should be expanded upon. Many a time I've said I'd shoot someone for entering a space I was in but not until it gets down to about 3 or less players and I'm really not certain of the T. I would never "claim" with any more than 5 players I'm just curious as to what your definition of claiming is. When the game gets low on players killing those coming into your space tends to be a really smart move, most players wouldn't rush someone threatening to kill them if they get any closer without the intention of killing said person which would typically imply they're a T and I find killing them to be a pretty logical decision.

12. Killing a person if he refuses to go into a traitor tester is allowed, but will simply count as regular RDM
RDM by definition is Random Death Match meaning no reason whatsoever but typically taken as no reason to suggest the person's T so there's kind of a flaw there. A) It's not random it's for a reason B) It's a pretty good reason to kill someone even though there are those out there, like myself, who refuse to be tested.

3. Traitors must get first blood. Killing as an innocent before any body is found is bad and is not allowed
Please changes this to something along the lines of "Traitors must take first action, a kill made upon a traitor before anything incriminating has been committed will count as First Blood RDM and is punishable." because as is even though common sense tells most of us otherwise, killing a traitor if he pulls a knife on you in the first 30 seconds of the round isn't allowed, killing a traitor because you watched him plant c4 when no one was dead also not allowed, etc.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Deacon on July 14, 2012, 11:55:34 PM
18. Claiming rooms, territory, etc. is not allowed
I really think this should be expanded upon. Many a time I've said I'd shoot someone for entering a space I was in but not until it gets down to about 3 or less players and I'm really not certain of the T. I would never "claim" with any more than 5 players I'm just curious as to what your definition of claiming is. When the game gets low on players killing those coming into your space tends to be a really smart move, most players wouldn't rush someone threatening to kill them if they get any closer without the intention of killing said person which would typically imply they're a T and I find killing them to be a pretty logical decision.

12. Killing a person if he refuses to go into a traitor tester is allowed, but will simply count as regular RDM
RDM by definition is Random Death Match meaning no reason whatsoever but typically taken as no reason to suggest the person's T so there's kind of a flaw there. A) It's not random it's for a reason B) It's a pretty good reason to kill someone even though there are those out there, like myself, who refuse to be tested.

3. Traitors must get first blood. Killing as an innocent before any body is found is bad and is not allowed
Please changes this to something along the lines of "Traitors must take first action, a kill made upon a traitor before anything incriminating has been committed will count as First Blood RDM and is punishable." because as is even though common sense tells most of us otherwise, killing a traitor if he pulls a knife on you in the first 30 seconds of the round isn't allowed, killing a traitor because you watched him plant c4 when no one was dead also not allowed, etc.

Your overly literal interpretation of the rules is undue.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: ursus on July 15, 2012, 12:43:27 AM
because as is even though common sense tells most of us otherwise, killing a traitor if he pulls a knife on you in the first 30 seconds of the round isn't allowed, killing a traitor because you watched him plant c4 when no one was dead also not allowed, etc.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Please, please be joking.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Shockah on July 15, 2012, 02:56:45 AM
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Please, please be joking.

Believe me I know most of you haven't exactly been overly active on ttt in a while, that's the shit I had to deal with 24/7 on temp. Though yes, I was exaggerating to an extreme, that being said that's literally how some people take the rules is how they're written. I'd rather simply have the wording changed which takes little to no effort then have to sift through every complaint of "RMD!". I'm not asking for a change of the rules just wording so that it actually fits what is and isn't punishable .-.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: semy32 on July 15, 2012, 02:59:45 AM
3. Traitors must get first blood. Killing as an innocent before any body is found is bad and is not allowed
Please changes this to something along the lines of "Traitors must take first action, a kill made upon a traitor before anything incriminating has been committed will count as First Blood RDM and is punishable." because as is even though common sense tells most of us otherwise, killing a traitor if he pulls a knife on you in the first 30 seconds of the round isn't allowed, killing a traitor because you watched him plant c4 when no one was dead also not allowed, etc.

That is just very stupid.

So you are saying that we should just let them do anything until they kill someone with a knife in their hands? Really?
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Prox on July 15, 2012, 03:04:13 AM

2. Pre-round prop kill is frowned upon, but not kickable unless committed multiple times

I don't generally allow pre-round prop killing and as far as I was aware no admin has really ever been okay with it. It disables players from preparing for the round, getting weapons, etc. Shouldn't be allowed period imo.
Right now the only way to prop kill is to hit another prop with the prop you're holding, unless prop pushing which is not allowed in all cases.



6. Map glitching (ie going somewhere textures are missing or nobody can possibly get to you) is not allowed

Map glitching is usually dealt with differently than that. As long as the player has not gained any advantage over other players to potentially uneven the fairness of the game, then I allow it as most other admins just so people can have a little fun. So I suggest somewhere saying that no rules are complete concrete and that players must listen to the admin in-game but may post complaints or suggestions if they disagree with what the admin is enforcing.
It was like this the whole time, people were just too lazy to update it.


7. Killing more than 4 innocents as an innocent or detective, OR, killing a single traitor as a traitor is kickable.

I usually ban after three in one round, as do most other admins as far as I'm aware. Still depends on the situation however. They're only banned if they're blatantly running around gunning down every person they can.
If they do that this it means that they would kill the whole server if they could so obviously it's a mass rdm even if he managed to kill 3. Killing 4 innocents or fellow T should also be allowed if it was self defense.

9. Carrying explosive barrels around people when Innocent or Detective and intentionally trying to get them killed by them is up to personal opinion of VIP/admin

I think this should simply be allowed as it's really just a part of the game. If the map implements things such as this that can be legitimately taken advantage of by players, then I don't see any problem with it. The only situation I don't allow this is when they whack the barrel against a dead body or something so that it blows up and results in no karma loss. Or prop pushing/trapping.
I guess as long as someone has to shoot the barrel it could be fine.


11. Killing with the bridge on crummycradle is frowned upon, but allowed

I think this should just be modified to say "Killing with props as a spectator is frowned upon, but allowed in all circumstances
Obviously it should and it has always been like this.


14. Killing other players in any way that does not effect your karma unless it is a map trap is not allowed

"unless it is a map trap or a spectator controlled prop"
Your modified 11th rule already includes prop killing as spectator.


16. Baiting other innocents into shooting you with an intent to make they karma go down is not allowed

Baiting has always been allowed to a degree. Running up and shooting someone in the toe to get them to kill you however, is not allowed. Shooting around players is, however. Though if it becomes a huge annoyance to players and is constantly done, then I usually tell them not to and may eventually give a short ban. I think that line should be adjusted to support that view more.
If someone is shooting around a group of players it isn't that bad but when that player shoots at someone once they are alone is retarded as fuck and I give warnings on that, if the player repeats it, I kick him.


Why? Zombies can get through, it's just a matter of hitting enough to get rid of the nails.
Indestructible props = indestructible nails. 



3. Traitors must get first blood. Killing as an innocent before any body is found is bad and is not allowed

should be more like

3. Traitors must do something(ie pull out a knife, plant c4, shoot or kill someone) before they can be suspected and killed.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Shockah on July 15, 2012, 04:22:44 AM

3. Traitors must get first blood. Killing as an innocent before any body is found is bad and is not allowed

should be more like

3. Traitors must do something(ie pull out a knife, plant c4, shoot or kill someone) before they can be suspected and killed.

Thank you that's what I was trying to say.

That is just very stupid.

So you are saying that we should just let them do anything until they kill someone with a knife in their hands? Really?

No I was saying that's what that sentence states, and the sentence should be changed accordingly because newer, and a longtime on occasion, players can very easily get confused of the rules if they're written incorrectly and not actually the rules, rightly so I might add. My apologies for explaining my points so terribly :c
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Prox on July 15, 2012, 05:49:36 AM
Keep in mind that the official server rules can be found here. (http://wiki.randomgs.com/index.php?title=Server_Rules)

   Also it would be nice to see an in-game command such as "!rules" which would allow for everyone to take a look at the rules anytime they want.
It would be great that there would be a redirect to the wiki rule page too
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Travelsonic on July 15, 2012, 07:51:32 AM
Actually, I think this should be discussed. I personally think that killing with a map trap should in any situation be fine as long as you don't lose karma for it and it's not a detective or traitor buddy that you're killing. Keep in mind, it's not like we have any maps that can kill a large amount of people on the server without it really being to their fault without losing karma.
And it does sound silly, but basically I don't consider it RDM if the trap doesn't affect karma. If it does, obviously it is RDM. Basically people can always really quite easily avoid being killed by any non-karmable map trap, and it's simply part of the map anyways. If that's there and a problem, the map simply should be removed. But anyways, non-karmable map traps can actually be an easy way to get rid of foolish/reckless players more or less. Can eliminate people you might suspect and stuff in a way that I personally think is fairly legitimate, as again, there's not really any map trap that's non-karmable which you can not simply avoid.

I'm really having trouble agreeing with this.

I mean, at ts core, if you're killing somebody for no reason at all, it's RDM, it doesn't matter if you use props, map traps, or guns, or if your kamra is affected at all, or if its part of the map.  Last thing we need is any kind of loophole to make playing difficult.

Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Prox on July 15, 2012, 08:17:05 AM
I'm really having trouble agreeing with this.

I mean, at ts core, if you're killing somebody for no reason at all, it's RDM, it doesn't matter if you use props, map traps, or guns, or if your kamra is affected at all, or if its part of the map.  Last thing we need is any kind of loophole to make playing difficult.
The main purpose of the traps is to kill people. I don't see a single reason why we should not allow players use all the features of the map.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Travelsonic on July 15, 2012, 08:31:22 AM
The main purpose of the traps is to kill people. I don't see a single reason why we should not allow players use all the features of the map.

Um, last I checked "Unless you are a Traitor, killing people with map traps for no reason shouldn't be allowed" is not saying what you suggest.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Prox on July 15, 2012, 08:42:38 AM
Um, last I checked "Unless you are a Traitor, killing people with map traps for no reason shouldn't be allowed" is not saying what you suggest.
13. Using map traps (i.e. the electric trap in ttt_whitehouse) to kill others is allowed, but using them to kill teammates is not.

14. Killing other players in any way that does not effect your karma unless it is a map trap is NOT ALLOWED!
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Sabb on July 15, 2012, 01:03:25 PM
Indestructible props = indestructible nails. 



3. Traitors must get first blood. Killing as an innocent before any body is found is bad and is not allowed

should be more like

3. Traitors must do something(ie pull out a knife, plant c4, shoot or kill someone) before they can be suspected and killed.
2. Yes, that's what I'm saying lol.

6. Obviously I'm saying that it should be updated then, clearly I'm aware that's is always been like that as I enforce it.

7. Again, kind of what I'm saying.

11. Yes, but I think it should be reworded that was as people often interpret the rule differently somehow and say "no, that kind of prop killing isn't allowed", etc.

14. Yes, should the rules not be consistent? lol Again, people take the rules quite literally often, and would easily be confused by two contradicting rules.

16. It really depends for me. It can often be worse when they do it in a group and try to make it convincing to make everyone lose karma. Often if they do it in a group it just ends up turning into a huge chain of killing. So still really depends on the situation.


With your edit, I guess I can agree, though I've never had a problem with players taking the rule quite that literally.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Travelsonic on August 04, 2012, 03:27:45 PM
13. Using map traps (i.e. the electric trap in ttt_whitehouse) to kill others is allowed, but using them to kill teammates is not.

14. Killing other players in any way that does not effect your karma unless it is a map trap is NOT ALLOWED!

...

How does this address my point?

You just reiterated the current proposed rule, with the same loophole we've been arguing about.


EDIT:

Another thought: Append the rule so far as what constitutes baiting.

Why not make it "As innocent or detective, any action that provokes another player into shooting - injuring or killing - the player provoking"?

Shooting around somebody is not the only act one can reasonably call baiting, IMO.

Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Prox on August 17, 2012, 11:00:02 AM
A few modifications to Zs rules that must be implemented:

16. Making sky cades aka tree houses that are high enough that zombies aren't able to damage it from below is allowed but it really should not. It's a massive waste of time for the zombies and it's far too easy to win for the humans, it only causes people to rage quit.

17. Using large pools of water to avoid getting hit by the zombies is considered as delaying the round and should be not allowed
 It's almost just as bad as sky cading if not worse.

Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Sabb on August 17, 2012, 11:53:45 AM
17. Using large pools of water to avoid getting hit by the zombies is considered as delaying the round and should be not allowed
 It's almost just as bad as sky cading if not worse.
Wtf? That's just a part of the game, I never really considered that a problem or heard people complain about it as a problem.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Prox on August 17, 2012, 11:59:32 AM
Wtf? That's just a part of the game, I never really considered that a problem or heard people complain about it as a problem.
You don't hear them complaining because they rage quit. In such maps as abstraction it is next to impossible to even hit someone in the water, trust me, I know what I'm talking about.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Alkaline on August 17, 2012, 01:28:54 PM
16. Making sky cades aka tree houses that are high enough that zombies aren't able to damage it from below is allowed but it really should not. It's a massive waste of time for the zombies and it's far too easy to win for the humans, it only causes people to rage quit.
I agree with this. The only problem is that people who are use to doing it will complain about it and will use the excuse that they saw someone do it before.
I think the code for the aegis should be edited so people can't put boards in abstract positions. In other words, it places the board parallel to the surface it's being applied to rather than checking if a piece of the board is inside of world geometry. Doing this would make the game A LOT more bearable.

17. Using large pools of water to avoid getting hit by the zombies is considered as delaying the round and should be not allowed
 It's almost just as bad as sky cading if not worse.
It's fucking horrible enough that zombies have limited control to hit humans. Once again, instead of having to repeatedly enforce this rule and listen to people complain, the code SHOULD be edited so humans can have: lower air supply, humans would move slower in water, and slower regain of oxygen rather than an immediate one.

EDIT: In addition to improving the cade kit, make the chem explosion check for prop_physics within a specific radius of the chem explosion and ignite them. Glitched cades work due to the fact that the origin of the plank is hidden from the origin of the chem explosion, so igniting the planks should help out.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Cryptokid on August 18, 2012, 01:09:26 AM
 I wouldn't be so quick to ban sky cades. Think about what it takes to get one started:
- 20 kills for a cade kit
- several minutes for enough regens to be able to make a platform
- time to actually make a safe platform that can't be hurt from fasties

If the zombies know you are making a sky cade or preparing one and make no push or do anything about it, then I think they deserve having to figure out how to deal with the tough cade. On top of this, I seem to recall a number of occasions where large tree house cades were completely destroyed due to teamwork on the zombies behalf. Sometimes the zombies just really suck lol.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Doctor Who on August 18, 2012, 01:37:45 AM
It's fucking horrible enough that zombies have limited control to hit humans. Once again, instead of having to repeatedly enforce this rule and listen to people complain, the code SHOULD be edited so humans can have: lower air supply, humans would move slower in water, and slower regain of oxygen rather than an immediate one.
Then, what would be the use of objective maps like checkpoint if we're going to move slower in water with less air supply
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Prox on August 18, 2012, 04:32:17 AM
I wouldn't be so quick to ban sky cades. Think about what it takes to get one started:
- 20 kills for a cade kit
- several minutes for enough regens to be able to make a platform
- time to actually make a safe platform that can't be hurt from fasties

If the zombies know you are making a sky cade or preparing one and make no push or do anything about it, then I think they deserve having to figure out how to deal with the tough cade. On top of this, I seem to recall a number of occasions where large tree house cades were completely destroyed due to teamwork on the zombies behalf. Sometimes the zombies just really suck lol.
That does not matter at all. The point is that it's far too easy to win in that cade.
Besides zombies might not be always aware that someone is making a sky cade and even if they are, they might not be able to get close enough without getting killed.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Deacon on August 18, 2012, 10:21:10 AM
Then, what would be the use of objective maps like checkpoint if we're going to move slower in water with less air supply

Strategy.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Prox on August 18, 2012, 01:34:37 PM
Added those to the wiki page, would be nice if admin would update op.
16. Making sky cades aka tree houses that are high enough that zombies aren't able to damage it from below is not allowed

17. Using large pools of water to avoid getting hit by the zombies is considered as delaying the round and is not allowed

Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Alkaline on August 18, 2012, 03:53:11 PM
Then, what would be the use of objective maps like checkpoint if we're going to move slower in water with less air supply

I'm suggesting that humans should move slower underwater, have a slow regain of oxygen, OR a lower air-supply. Either one of those would work in conjunction with helping the zombies and keeping the humans from using a cheap strategy. If all three of those were implemented, then checkpoint would be the only map affected by it, even though the humans only need two of the three total cores.

I guess my opinion should get -1'd.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Cryptokid on August 18, 2012, 09:33:59 PM
16. Using cade boards from the Aegis Barricade Kit to make a sky-cade/tree-house/isolated structure above the ground that cannot be hit from beneath by a normal zombie OR is ~256 units off the floor below is NOT ALLOWED!

This is bullshit. Several players have already complained to me about this rule on the server. I think it should be up to the VIP or Admin to decide whether or not to do something about it because I really don't want to have to enforce it.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Prox on August 19, 2012, 03:42:37 AM
16. Using cade boards from the Aegis Barricade Kit to make a sky-cade/tree-house/isolated structure above the ground that cannot be hit from beneath by a normal zombie OR is ~256 units off the floor below is NOT ALLOWED!

This is bullshit. Several players have already complained to me about this rule on the server. I think it should be up to the VIP or Admin to decide whether or not to do something about it because I really don't want to have to enforce it.
It's far too OP for humans, and for those who complained, I think it's about time to learn to play the game without using cheap methods.
  And you will have to enforce it, just like I did once when people voted this to be allowed when I said otherwise. I had no choice but make it allowed.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Cryptokid on August 19, 2012, 10:39:59 AM
It's far too OP for humans, and for those who complained, I think it's about time to learn to play the game without using cheap methods.
  And you will have to enforce it, just like I did once when people voted this to be allowed when I said otherwise. I had no choice but make it allowed.

Where was I when this was voted to be a rule? You wanted new zs, so play that. Stop trying to change the old one as well.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Prox on August 19, 2012, 11:31:29 AM
Where was I when this was voted to be a rule? You wanted new zs, so play that. Stop trying to change the old one as well.
You can't force me to stop enforcing, suggesting and applying rules to specific servers, I'm a VIP for a reason.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Cryptokid on August 19, 2012, 03:59:04 PM
I'm not asking you to stop enforcing. I'm asking when this was voted on being a rule that I only just now found out about it after it was passed. I also don't understand why you made such a push for the new zs and now that we have a server for it, you're messing with the old one too.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Prox on August 19, 2012, 04:15:08 PM
I'm not asking you to stop enforcing. I'm asking when this was voted on being a rule that I only just now found out about it after it was passed. I also don't understand why you made such a push for the new zs and now that we have a server for it, you're messing with the old one too.
I'm "messing up" with every server, not just Zs, and what made me do such a push? Well firstly it was 2 VIPs vs 1 VIP opinion and since nobody else was replying I didn't see the reason to wait any longer and admit it, it is easy as fuck to win the game by using those methods.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Prox on August 23, 2012, 03:33:43 AM
Suggestion to the TTT rules:
16. Baiting other innocents into shooting you with an intent to make their karma go down is not allowed and will result in a ban without a warning.

And for fucks sake update the OP already with the new Zs rules.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Juan_Ambriz on August 23, 2012, 07:30:06 AM
I'm "messing up" with every server, not just Zs, and what made me do such a push? Well firstly it was 2 VIPs vs 1 VIP opinion and since nobody else was replying I didn't see the reason to wait any longer and admit it, it is easy as fuck to win the game by using those methods.

Prox what? Stop. You didn't openly ask everyone, not everyone sees this thread or is on periodically. You can't just base something of two VIPS that are completely biased. If you had and actual vote with the entire server then I wouldn't mind.

And as crypto said, you hate the old ZS then leave it the alone. Go and play the new ZS. I mean it's on the server, why do you have to be ruining this server for the people who like it and still have it?
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Deathie on August 23, 2012, 07:50:36 AM
Eh.

My opinion on sky cades were that they were fine as long as they weren't in a glitch spot (off map or something similar).

While they do give a massive advantage (only reachable by fast zombies), they take a long time to construct, and aren't generally used until the endgame.

Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Prox on August 23, 2012, 08:03:43 AM
Prox what? Stop. You didn't openly ask everyone, not everyone sees this thread or is on periodically. You can't just base something of two VIPS that are completely biased. If you had and actual vote with the entire server then I wouldn't mind.

And as crypto said, you hate the old ZS then leave it the alone. Go and play the new ZS. I mean it's on the server, why do you have to be ruining this server for the people who like it and still have it?
Why should I? So that all the people who use those methods would disagree with me? Because so far they were the only people who disagreed. And the fact that I made this whole thread almost by myself can prove that I do have a good understanding of rules and the current hosted game modes(or most of them). And if you are calling us biased then you two are biased as well.

And could you just fucking stop with that old and new ZS bullshit? I've already heard people saying that shit and it's not the case why I'm doing this. In case you all haven't been aware, I've been updating the rules all the fucking time.

Now when you say that I ruin the ZS you obviously only think about yourselves. You don't care that 10 or more zombies have to desperately try to get to the humans when all they can do is die or make a few scratches on a board which does not matter since by the time the board breaks the cader regens 2 more boards. And in case someone actually thinks that using those methods is "pro" then, they're fucking retarded.

Eh.

My opinion on sky cades were that they were fine as long as they weren't in a glitch spot (off map or something similar).

While they do give a massive advantage (only reachable by fast zombies), they take a long time to construct, and aren't generally used until the endgame.


And yet that spot in Zs_anchor is banned but you think the sky cading is fine? Sky cading gives a much bigger advantage then that spot.
Also I've seen people having a sky cade fully built at wave 5 or 6 so yeah, nah.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Deathie on August 23, 2012, 10:19:09 AM
And yet that spot in Zs_anchor is banned but you think the sky cading is fine? Sky cading gives a much bigger advantage then that spot.
Also I've seen people having a sky cade fully built at wave 5 or 6 so yeah, nah.

First off, get off your fucking period.
It doesn't help you get any of your points across, you just come off as an arrogant asshole who can't see anyone else's views aside from your own, so just calm the fuck down.

Second, the spot behind zs_anchor is far worse than sky cades.

They're both only accessible by fast zombies, but unlike sky cading, the fence in anchor isn't breakable, you can shoot through the fence unlike the wooden planks in a sky cade, and the spot on anchor is accessible right away from wave one.

And for fucks sake update the OP already with the new Zs rules.

You should realize that since these are the "official" rules, Coolz is the only one who should really be modifying them. Maybe you should send him a nice PM politely saying "for fucks sake update the OP already", because that's always the way to get on peoples good sides.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Prox on August 23, 2012, 10:39:14 AM
Glad to see you're still mad because of TF2, but if you would actually play ZS, you would understand that sky cading is much worse since its a 95% guaranteed victory for the humans when in the anchor humans used to lose the game most of the time when they were in that spot.

Also if I use swear words it doesn't mean that I'm mad, but I have to say that I'm not very pleased about this either.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Deathie on August 23, 2012, 10:59:30 AM
Glad to see you're still mad because of TF2, but if you would actually play ZS, you would understand that sky cading is much worse since its a 95% guaranteed victory for the humans when in the anchor humans used to lose the game most of the time when they were in that spot.

You're hilarious.

Please, do continue.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Sabb on August 23, 2012, 11:38:04 AM
Suggestion to the TTT rules:
16. Baiting other innocents into shooting you with an intent to make their karma go down is not allowed and will result in a ban without a warning.

And for fucks sake update the OP already with the new Zs rules.
Just no. It's allowed as it should be allowed.
I would make it something more along the lines of "not recommended and in some cases is bannable by VIP/admin judgement."

But I guess I'll edit the OP later with some of these rules or suggest coolz to do so. Probably tomorrow or possibly tonight as I'm too tired right now. If someone bumps the thread tomorrow in case I forget that would probably help. Or just PM me obviously, either or.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Prox on August 23, 2012, 11:46:05 AM
Just no. It's allowed as it should be allowed.
I would make it something more along the lines of "not recommended and in some cases is bannable by VIP/admin judgement."

But I guess I'll edit the OP later with some of these rules or suggest coolz to do so. Probably tomorrow or possibly tonight as I'm too tired right now. If someone bumps the thread tomorrow in case I forget that would probably help. Or just PM me obviously, either or.
19. Traitor baiting is dependent on the situation, but generally frowned upon. Up to each VIP/admin's personal judgement

That's what it is like in the wiki right now. And I absolutely disagree with making it allowed, it would be much better just to leave it as it is right now.

Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Sabb on August 23, 2012, 01:23:51 PM
19. Traitor baiting is dependent on the situation, but generally frowned upon. Up to each VIP/admin's personal judgement

That's what it is like in the wiki right now. And I absolutely disagree with making it allowed, it would be much better just to leave it as it is right now.
Then that's what I'm saying lol. It's fine to ban for it in some situations but it's not necessarily officially against the rules, which is how it really should be.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Juan_Ambriz on August 23, 2012, 02:50:53 PM
Why should I? So that all the people who use those methods would disagree with me? Because so far they were the only people who disagreed. And the fact that I made this whole thread almost by myself can prove that I do have a good understanding of rules and the current hosted game modes(or most of them). And if you are calling us biased then you two are biased as well.

And could you just fucking stop with that old and new ZS bullshit? I've already heard people saying that shit and it's not the case why I'm doing this. In case you all haven't been aware, I've been updating the rules all the fucking time.

Now when you say that I ruin the ZS you obviously only think about yourselves. You don't care that 10 or more zombies have to desperately try to get to the humans when all they can do is die or make a few scratches on a board which does not matter since by the time the board breaks the cader regens 2 more boards. And in case someone actually thinks that using those methods is "pro" then, they're fucking retarded.
And yet that spot in Zs_anchor is banned but you think the sky cading is fine? Sky cading gives a much bigger advantage then that spot.
Also I've seen people having a sky cade fully built at wave 5 or 6 so yeah, nah.
Ok prox I have never made tree house probably once or twice, I don't do it everytime I get the chance. Also I never said people that make it are "pro" I just find it a way to survive, the point of the game is survive. And also I've been he zombie MANY. Times going for sky cades that alkaline and kurtis have made, but I never raged got frustrated or gave up, I just continued to play.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Prox on August 23, 2012, 03:55:55 PM
Ok prox I have never made tree house probably once or twice, I don't do it everytime I get the chance. Also I never said people that make it are "pro" I just find it a way to survive, the point of the game is survive. And also I've been he zombie MANY. Times going for sky cades that alkaline and kurtis have made, but I never raged got frustrated or gave up, I just continued to play.
Perhaps you didn't but I'm sure as hell other zombies did and lets face it, you would have much rather preferred them to be in a place where you could have killed them then in the sky cade.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Travelsonic on August 29, 2012, 12:00:25 PM
A suggestion for TTT:

- Killing somebody must be justifiable with something substantial - DNA, T weapons, killing and/or hurting others without reason, a "I'm with" being followed with that person being found dead by that very person they said they were with, etc.

Why?

People who come up with some of the stupidest horseshit to justify killing somebody else, and then turns around and gets belligerent when somebody dares to turn around and say, "That is bullshit, here's why".

For example, and I still have the demo amongst the thousands on my external hard drive, on Crazy Cubes, it was mentioned that Traitors liked to hesitate, and do nothing.  Everybody was breaking the cubes, which as anyone knows, makes it hard to trait.  I was merely pointing out that the reason they stagnate is because without the glass, the map becomes too open to reasonably act, and what happens?  *BAM* shot by Pilot.  I happened to be a Traitor.  Next round we get into an argument, I point out that he had no reason, and he stuck to the guns that making observations I made, which could be based on previous rounds, but are still ones anyone could make, T or not, was enough.

Seriously, common sense must exist somewhere.  Common sense must draw a line between something being solid, something being justifiable, something being hard to prove but sorta ok, and something being so horseshit that it can't be anything but RDM.  Sure it doesn't really happen often relatively speaking, but it happens, and others are getting the idea that this practice is OK, which - especially with all the Youtube driven newfags - is not OK at all.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Prox on August 29, 2012, 12:41:05 PM
Killing someone because of stupid reasons is equal to an RDM.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Sabb on August 29, 2012, 12:56:26 PM
Killing someone because of stupid reasons is equal to an RDM.
This. If anything just mention it where ever it mentions RDM in the rules. Like just add on (killing without any substantial reasoning is considered RDM).
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Travelsonic on August 29, 2012, 01:42:27 PM
This. If anything just mention it where ever it mentions RDM in the rules. Like just add on (killing without any substantial reasoning is considered RDM).

That would be much simpler than adding a whole new rule - I guess my suggestion was much more suited as an addendum note.

I think such a note is especially imperative with the swarm of Youtube newfags who come on this and other TTT servers, after watching videos of idiots who RDM, etc, and do the same.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: memo3300 on August 29, 2012, 02:11:52 PM
you know, when i used to play TTT, there were sometimes i killed traitors not using a DNA scanner, seeing him kill or hit someone or what was mentioned above.
how?

because if in the pre round you are in a room getting ammo with someone else, the rounds starts and he doesn't take the chance to kill you, you can assume he is an innocent.

I believe that karma is enough to punish a kill that ended up in a mistake, ATLEAST the reason of the kill was really stupid like "he looked at the wall"
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Prox on August 29, 2012, 02:55:28 PM
Please invite me when the youtube halfwits get on, I'll gladly ban them all.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Travelsonic on August 29, 2012, 03:35:09 PM
you know, when i used to play TTT, there were sometimes i killed traitors not using a DNA scanner, seeing him kill or hit someone or what was mentioned above.
how?

because if in the pre round you are in a room getting ammo with someone else, the rounds starts and he doesn't take the chance to kill you, you can assume he is an innocent.

But the problem with that is, it is never a sure thing.  Sure, an inno may not kill you then and there, then again a T for whatever may not always start shooting at you either - regardless of the reason [not getting a good gun/ammo, being chicken, or playing a psychological game with you]. 
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: memo3300 on August 29, 2012, 03:56:04 PM
But the problem with that is, it is never a sure thing.  Sure, an inno may not kill you then and there, then again a T for whatever may not always start shooting at you either - regardless of the reason [not getting a good gun/ammo, being chicken, or playing a psychological game with you]. 
A suggestion for TTT:

- Killing somebody must be justifiable with something substantial - DNA, T weapons, killing and/or hurting others without reason, a "I'm with" being followed with that person being found dead by that very person they said they were with, etc.

DNA, can be an innocent that killed another innocent, or even and innocent going derp and killing detective.

T weapons, can be found if traitors drop it or if someone kills a traitor.

Killing / hurting, still can be an innocent.



Nothing will be allways reliable, at least someone have a knife at second 3 of the round.


Pretty much, the player should be able to argument the kills with something that gives chances of the guy being traitor.

I have killed a traitor just because he dropped the DNA scanner in a place hard to find, because i found it weird.

Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Travelsonic on October 19, 2012, 05:10:11 PM
On the spawncamping thing:  Honestly...

The camping mobile spawns thing is great, make perfect sense, but allowing it for nonmobile [i.e MAP] spawns, with no other rules, is just..... no.

No rule on props means somebody can use props to surround a map spawn, and camp that - and how exactly, with that the case, can you enjoy the game if you *herp* can't play it?
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Juan_Ambriz on October 19, 2012, 05:28:44 PM
On the spawncamping thing:  Honestly...

The camping mobile spawns thing is great, make perfect sense, but allowing it for nonmobile [i.e MAP] spawns, with no other rules, is just..... no.

No rule on props means somebody can use props to surround a map spawn, and camp that - and how exactly, with that the case, can you enjoy the game if you *herp* can't play it?

Im guessing stronghold right?

i thought its kickable to spawncamp outside spawns.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Deacon on October 19, 2012, 06:11:19 PM
On the spawncamping thing:  Honestly...

The camping mobile spawns thing is great, make perfect sense, but allowing it for nonmobile [i.e MAP] spawns, with no other rules, is just..... no.

No rule on props means somebody can use props to surround a map spawn, and camp that - and how exactly, with that the case, can you enjoy the game if you *herp* can't play it?

Blocking map spawns would fall under jurisdiction of rule #2 and would be subject to punishment.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Travelsonic on October 19, 2012, 07:01:46 PM
Im guessing stronghold right?

i thought its kickable to spawncamp outside spawns.

Not according to OP it seems.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Deacon on October 19, 2012, 08:17:16 PM
Not according to OP it seems.

RULE 2
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Prox on October 20, 2012, 02:26:47 AM
On the spawncamping thing:  Honestly...

The camping mobile spawns thing is great, make perfect sense, but allowing it for nonmobile [i.e MAP] spawns, with no other rules, is just..... no.
Camping map spawns is not a problem at all since there are plenty of them all across the map and you get a spawn protection as well. In fact making it not allowed could actually cause more problems since a lot of players who don't make bases or camp one specific spot usually are more or less near to a map spawn and I can already imagine how someone spawns in front of someone and then he gets killed and says "stop spawncamping etc".

No rule on props means somebody can use props to surround a map spawn, and camp that - and how exactly, with that the case, can you enjoy the game if you *herp* can't play it?
2. Blocking map spawns is not allowed
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Prox on February 07, 2013, 02:39:35 PM
Rule list for TTT on the Wiki modified with this:
Quote
3. Players must do something(ie pull out a knife, plant c4, shoot or kill someone) before they can be suspected and killed. Killing a player at the start of the round before he has done anything is NOT ALLOWED!
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Travelsonic on March 31, 2013, 08:04:37 AM
ZS: Spamming ammo crates, or standing on hem to prevent people from using them, regardless of what is inside them, should not be allowed.  I know many VIPS, and admins, have been [rightfully] anal the few times one has been on and we played on a map when this was a problem, but it'd be easier to control if it were a rule as IMO it is damn annoying, and could even be construed as aiding the zombie team in a way I doubt many people would find reasonable on the part of a human teammate.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Prox on April 01, 2013, 08:01:36 AM
ZS: Spamming ammo crates, or standing on hem to prevent people from using them, regardless of what is inside them, should not be allowed.  I know many VIPS, and admins, have been [rightfully] anal the few times one has been on and we played on a map when this was a problem, but it'd be easier to control if it were a rule as IMO it is damn annoying, and could even be construed as aiding the zombie team in a way I doubt many people would find reasonable on the part of a human teammate.
Ammo crates are optional, not vital to the gameplay and I personally never had problems with people spamming or standing on top of it, I even do it myself.
 It's actually even better when someone does this because then those people who want to get more ammo/nades that they'll ever need actually may think about focusing on the main objective or at least to share the ammo with others, and I myself have never seen anyone who would stand on the ammo crate for the entire time just to be dick, he either get's bored or just simply gets killed by the zombies.
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Travelsonic on April 06, 2013, 09:03:12 AM
Ammo crates are optional, not vital to the gameplay

Ammo is always a necessity - whether you are stuck with a shit gun and pump your bullets into a Z only to lose it to another player [exemplifying the need for assist kills], or just redeemed with little ammo, if a gun at all, or only find a shit gun with no ammo, or used more shots than needed due to gmod's hitboxes getting consistently worse since gmod 13. 

One problem I think is the amount of ammo given.  Perhaps if that amount was considerably lower then my argument would be easier to agree with
Title: Re: Have a suggestion for the rules? Maybe a modificaiton?
Post by: Deacon on April 06, 2013, 09:23:12 AM
  One problem I think is the amount of ammo given.  Perhaps if that amount was considerably lower then my argument would be easier to agree with

If reality was different, my point would make sense.

Except its not. So no I disagree. I don't like people spamming crates but making it a rule is stupid. Youll drive off people who usually dont know any better. Try talking to them, instead of kicking them. As many of our VIPs and admins are aware, asking before action solves the problem 9 times out of 10.